Finally got a Hodaka... Though it needs a bit...

Bullfrog · Post by **Bullfrog** » Sun Jun 05, 2016 1:59 pm

Don't use the acetone/ATF mix anywhere around painted items. The acetone is not friendly to paint.
Ed

--- · Post by **---** » Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:09 am

Dale,

I wasn't trying to debunk anyone's claims regarding properties. Just trying to apply what science background I have. Marketing being what it is, a phrase like "magnetic properties" could just be shorthand for something most people would not grasp right away.

All matter exhibits magnetic properties to varying degrees. Faraday identified three different classes of magnetic response that I know of: diamagnetic, paramagnetic, and ferromagnetic. The differences between these are less important to this reference than are the similarities, in that all three exhibit response to a present magnetic field. I am pretty sure that no penetrating oil needs a magnetic field to function, whereas two very closely situated planes will cause surface tension of a liquid to seek those closely placed planes, hence penetration or penetrating oil. Most oils will also penetrate into the crystalline structure of iron or steel, which is why they are sometimes not easy to degrease before painting. In that case you need a penetrating solvent to remove the penetrated oil.

As for acetone, acetone is a mild solvent, which usually will not remove fully cured automotive paint. Fresh paint, sure, but 40 year old paint, no. Still, I would try a small test spot first before compromising an otherwise good paint surface, but I would suggest that anyway, regardless of the age of the paint or the solvent in question, including penetrating oil. Plus, the discussion I cited was aimed at penetrating rusted bolts and the effect on torque, not the effect on painted surfaces, so while the caution is well placed, it also isn't completely accurate. I have often used acetone as a degreaser on old painted surfaces prior to repainting, and have never seen acetone alone even etch the paint, much less remove it. Paint takes a long time to fully cure, but 40 to 50 years should be sufficient. Bottom line is this, with any chemical, use with caution if your principle aim is to preserve a painted surface. If you have to use a propane torch to heat the surfaces to remove the seal nuts, any paint in the immediate area isn't going to last anyway.

dcooke007 · Post by **dcooke007** » Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:50 am

I tried the acetone/atf mix and was not impressed. PB Blaster has been a go to for me and WD40 has a new penetrating oil that seems to work fairly well also. Kroil never seemed to work any better or worse than any other penetrant. PB Blaster is readily available as well as the new WD40 product....Kriol not so much in my area. Just my .02.

Danny

--- · Post by **---** » Mon Jun 06, 2016 9:45 am

I can't find Kroil here. Usually use blaster, but with no more than usual, somewhat limited results. It works, but it isn't magic.

I have never tried the acetone mix. I assume just looking at the blend that the acetone is there as a carrier for the ATF, and doesn't actually provide lubricant between nut and bolt. All penetrating oils as marketed have carriers which lighten the mixture and help in the penetration. That is, acetone or whatever other light solvent would probably penetrate a rusted bolt just fine, but it wouldn't necessarily make it easier to remove the nut because it isn't a lubricant as such. ATF alone would probably work better, but slower, than the 50/50 mix. But then ATF isn't what one would commonly think of as a slick lubricant. It is, of course, a lubricant but is more of an hydraulic fluid than lubricant per se. It does both functions, and can be used as a lubricant in light duty gear boxes, but it isn't the slickest stuff out there. It is principally intended for a low impact device, i.e., an automatic transmission where gears are planetary, and every gear is meshed all the time.

The test I mentioned was just something I ran across. It could easily be that their findings are based more on the test itself than on the ability of the ATF blend as a lubricant. Scientifically rusted may not be the same as a real, well rusted, bolt found on a forty year old machine. I posted it for what it was worth. It may not be worth a lot, especially if it didn't work for you. I know I have run into situations in the past where a bolt or nut simply did not respond to penetraters, with or without heat, and I have split more than one nut as a last resort. I don't think there is a silver bullet in the penetrating oil market. But I do believe they are not all created equal.

TheBevman · Post by **TheBevman** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 6:07 pm

Well, shifting back to the purpose of the thread. I figured, since I couldn't find much on rebuilding an Ace 90 forks, I'd put our endeavor here for posterities sake. All told, they are relatively simple, as is the Hodaka way, and made it a good experience for my kids and I.

So, we finally got the circle nut/ lower fork shroud off after letting'er soak for a few days, as per the previous photo, and repeated applications of heat. I switched to using a heat gun as per ddvorak's recommendation, because as AZ Shorty mentioned, it's better for the paint.

To preserve the circle nuts we decided to McGyver our own solution since the strap wrench couldn't grip well enough after all manner of attempts we came up with a new game plan.

TheBevman · Post by **TheBevman** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 6:30 pm

After a quick clean and look-c it was clear that we need new consumables. The forks are worn in a few spots but with the budget going into the red we put our heads together and decided they would work for our purpose.

I intended to do a full photo collage of the break down and build up, but we were having fun and just kept chugging along. To anyone doing this for the first time, the manual lays it out well. The hardest part for us was r & r-ing the fork seals in the circle nut. So, as a result, I didn't take any photos of the breakdown but did get a few of the better part of the team assembling their respective fork.

TheBevman · Post by **TheBevman** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 7:00 pm

The team and I had some time tonight and decided to clean up the speedo drive we scored off an auction site for almost nothing. The one that came off the Ace wasn't salvageable. A quick dis-assembley and inspection proved all was well. Of course there was the obligatory hunt for a sprung clip or two across the garage (finder got a brownie, it was good too!) and a clean and lube was all that was required before assembly. Since tomorrow's Father's Day and all, I've told my kids that Papa wants some clean and fixed up Hodaka wheels for his special day. Looks like I'd better renew my stash of sweets to keep the team sugared up and energized. Hope to post more soon.