Gears Not Engaging!!!

[Bullfrog]

Victor:

While are curing the pilot jet plugging issue . . . put in an in-line fuel filter OK? We all really need on with 40 year old steel tanks.

Ed

[viclioce]

I've been using an in line filter since day one. ; D Victor

[taber hodaka]

victor do not run the bike wide open shut down and pull the plug to test jetting. a rich engine goes blip blip blip blip blip and on a lean engiune runs eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee proper would be eeeeeeeeeeeeblip blip[eeeeeeeeeeeblipeeeeeeeeeeeeblipeee the plug test would be after running for some length of time . some day I will do a tuning demo-------------Clarence

[Zyx]

Aside from how it sounds, we were discussing the plug color as an indicator of condition. I pointed out that to do a main jet test based on color, you had to run the engine on the main jet for a period of time, top gear wide open for a bit, then shut down rapidly and pull the plug. Running around through the gears won't give you a picture of the main jet. So Victor is reflecting my comments. Advising not to shut down while running wide open has no basis in fact. It may not be something you have done, but that doesn't make it wrong. Reading plugs is a valid diagnostic tool, but knowing how to do it is important to the validity of the effort.

[taber hodaka]

While you are breaking in a motor tune it by sound. When it is broke in and you are tuning the main jet tune by sound first. then you can check the plug. Tune for how you ride also if you ride at 3/4 throttle make sure you are tuned for that range. Do not run wide open on a very lean jet. start big work down.-----------Clarence

[viclioce]

Well, I cleaned the pilot jet. It was bad. I couldn't see thru it looking down the tube. Now it's Shiney clean. BUT the F'ing bike still wouldn't start. So I'm back to trying to adjust the points again. I'm beginning to wonder if the left crank seal has come loose. I hope not. Ran a compression test with the throttle open and got a 125 psi reading on a brand new meter. No other reference points. But 125 psi should be good enough for a cylinder with a new set of rings that haven't seated yet. Going to keep trying. I just wish I had someone locally, who is skilled, that I could turn to for help. : / Victor

[viclioce]

OK. New development.

I pulled the flywheel to change out the points again. And THIS is what I found. This is what's left of the wood drift key on my crank! No wonder I couldn't set the points/timing! New one on its way!

; D Victor

[Bullfrog]

While you have the flywheel off, be sure to check for a firm non-wobbling fit of the internal taper of the flywheel to the taper on the crank. You could even "paint" the crank taper with a blue Sharpie then fit up the flywheel and rotate it by hand on the taper to check for even contact all the way around the taper -- AND the full length of the taper.

Generally speaking, Woodruff keys only show damage when the tapers are damaged. The Woodruff key can NOT "hold" the flywheel in position if the tapers do not seat up well. The design function of the taper is to provide the functional "lock" of the flywheel to the crank. Finding a damaged woodruff key is a symptom of ill fitting/damaged tapers.

Ed

[Zyx]

The key was also not fully seated when the flywheel was last installed, and it was forced out of its slot toward the engine, which is why it is sheared. Verify the crank slot is not distorted, it probably is, and that the flywheel taper slot is not distorted, it probably is also. Any distortion, raised edges, and so on must be dressed out of the parts before reinstalling the flywheel or it won't fully seat. If you use dye on the parts as suggested you are going to see any such distortions. While the crank and taper are hardened and the key is not, it takes a lot of pressure to shear an eighth of an inch thick key.

Once everything is ready for installation, be very careful putting the flywheel over the woodruff key and be sure it is fully seated and engaged before applying any pressure to the flywheel. Particularly, NEVER use the flywheel nut to force the flywheel into position. If you can't put the flywheel fully onto the crank with hand pressure only, something is not right. Stop and make it right.

Also check your crank end threads and flywheel nut. Too much pressure applied to the nut will draw the threads. Nuts are easy to replace with new, crank threads are not easy to repair. The pressure needed to shear a key is far more than the specified torque for the assembly, so look closely at the crank threads and be certain they were not distorted or stripped. I would use a new nut just to be sure, and I would verify that the nut can be turned on the crank end with finger pressure only before reinstalling the flywheel.

[viclioce]

OK. I think the actual reason the woodruff sheared was the flywheel nut came loose. So the flywheel was moving around and not staying in one place. I think this happened once before. Dan tells me there should have been a star washer with the nut on the crankshaft when you tighten down the nut for the flywheel. There was no star washer on there as long as I have had the bike. So, the flywheel nut was not staying tight. I'll remedy this by adding a star washer and just a bit of blue Loctite on the crank threads. This should keep it from loosening up. I will tighten her down to 14 ft lbs (170 inch pounds) and that should hold her in place.

Boy, no wonder I couldn't get the timing right AND she shut off on me hold going around the corner! ; D Victor

[Bullfrog]

You still need to check taper condition. The most recent loosening could have caused taper damage. OR . . . there could have been taper damage or improper Woodruff key installation which contributed to the loosening of the nut.

A properly working taper set will hold the flywheel even if the flywheel nut is removed. (of course, if the nut "works" its way loose in operation . . . SOMETHING has to cause that . . . and usually that SOMETHING would be improperly seated tapers).

Ed

[Zyx]

I agree with Ed. The nut did not just "come loose" and lock washer or no, torque on the nut will hold the nut. That's what torque is for. There are no parts to "work" once assembled and torqued. If there was sufficient misalignment for the taper and crank to work against each other, the key was not seated, had already sheared, and was holding parts away from each other.

Pictures can be deceiving, so looking at your sheared key, tell us in which direction metal was displaced, or sheared. From the photo it appears that the shear is along the flat top of the half moon, along the long line of the key. That is an assembly displacement. If the shear had been because the parts were simply not tight, the flywheel would have spun, or tried to, and the shear would be 90 degrees to the long line of the key.

I have CDI system on the 97, using an aftermarket unit, there is no key used, even though the crank is cut for one. The only thing holding the flywheel from spinning is the natural force of the taper, properly torqued. Once torqued, I don't think I would even know if the nut fell off. It takes a puller to break the parts loose. Yours is the same, once torqued, you have to have a puller to break the flywheel loose. My guess is you didn't have to do that this time.

[viclioce]

Well, you have your assumptions, and I have mine.

Twice the flywheel nut had loosened. I noticed that the key was already worn but was not sure how much when reassembling. It held for a while, but I now believe it's the reason the bike stopped running suddenly. There was a significant amount of filings surrounding the ignition & lighting coils.

I've cleaned and readied the shaft and coils and am awaiting the new woodruff key. Believe this is why I could not set the timing correctly and why it would not start. I'll know soon enough.

I've inspected the inside of the flywheel and the shaft. There does not appear to be damage. The groove for the woodruff key in the flywheel looks like it needs some smoothing. I can address that. Once reassembled and timing set, I believe I will be able to get back to the matter of jetting.

So just keep your fingers crossed for me. ; D Victor

[taber hodaka]

Victor please tell me what motorcycle we are discussing. 90--100--125?? Clarence

[viclioce]

Clarence. The bike is a 1976 Model 03 frame, a Model 94 bottom end, a Model 95 top end and has a Model 93 24mm carb. ; D Victor

[viclioce]

OK. Got the woodruff key today and got it installed. Two big THANK YOUs, to Bill Cook and to Dan Cooke! Bill sent me a free woodruff key and Dan talked me through all the install irregularities.

A tiny bit of blue loctite on the bottom of the key and another dab on the crank threads. Added the missing star washer behind the nut. The flywheel slipped right on, found the key and centered. Go the nut torqued down adequately, put the side cover back on, turned on the fuel petcock and.....

I gave her 3 or 4 kicks and she fired right up! Sure enough, it was the worn key that couldn't align the flywheel. She's running pretty good again. I didn't find any abnormalities within the center of the flywheel or on the shaft. However, the woodruff key slot in the center of the shaft had a few "bumps" in it for lack of a better word. I was able to knock those down with a small 4 sided file. The key seemed to fit well into the groove afterward.

Now I need to try adjusting the jets. She feels a bit sluggish, or maybe that's not an accurate adjective. She feels a bit under powered. The throttle response kind of bottoms out and it doesn't seem like I'm getting full throttle out of her.

I have the air screw set at 1 1/2 turns out as well as the idle screw at 1 1/2 turns which she seems to like. I may need to move the needle clip down one more notch, to see if I get a bit more umf out of her at full throttle.

I'll let you know how it goes! I may still be happy with the 140 main jet now that she is timed properly! ; D Victor

[viclioce]

OK, good news and bad news.

First, I have been riding the bike! And my grandson rode it for the first time yesterday. He's still being overwhelmed by the clutch, but in time I am sure he'll get the hang of it!

The bad news is, now that she's running the carb bowl is flooding over! I pulled the needle and seat and it appears the needle has a small groove in it about half way down the tapered point. I have tried adjusting the float tab but to no avail. I've adjusted it 3 times already and there appears to be not much change. It's still flowing over and dripping.

So I'm assuming the groove in the needle is hampering the needle from sealing off the seat and is not seating tightly, allowing gas to continue to flow into the bowl. I've ordered a new needle and seat and also new O Rings for the needle jet. The O Ring was looking a bit stretched. So I figured I would replace it as well. This may be causing the bike to still run rich, and main jet tuning will still not be possible until all these issues are addressed.

I will keep you all informed as to how things go, and hope that I am finally getting close.

Also, is there anyone out there who has a Combat Wombat piston in a .010 oversize? Discussions with Dan Cooke indicate that the non-ported piston I'm currently using doesn't take advantage of the additional porting in the Model 95 cylinder and being able to utilize the additional port would bring an increase in power to the bike. Thanks again! ; D Victor

[viclioce]

She is running!!! And pretty good too! I'm going to increase the main jet until she runs with a sputter and then come back down one size! Now I can see the specs that Paul posted saying this bike should have a 160 main jet at 7,000 feet, with a 24mm carb. I'm 2 sizes below that right now and she feels a bit under powered. So hopefully a 150 or 160 will do well with the pilot jet now being at 30 instead of 40! ; D Victor

[viclioce]

I wanted to post a video of me riding my Hodaka with the last post but it wouldn't upload! It was about a 30 second video from an iPod but it wouldn't upload. It says the file extension MOV not allowed. Sorry! ; D Victor

[viclioce]

Well. Last night I rode the Hodaka over to the Suzuki/Yamaha/Kawasaki dealership. They were having a "2 Stroke Bike Night!" The bike isn't street legal and registered yet so I rode there and back on the sidewalks!

Pulled in and a lot of the guys who work at the dealership were so happy to see it. I'd been talking to them and showing pictures to them for a while now. Several times it was referred to as "the most exotic bike in the show!"

And I took 3rd Place in the competition! I'm very proud of this, especially when you consider that the 1st place bike was a 1975 RD 350 Yamaha, which was restored factory original by one of the older shop mechanics! I can't even remember which bike took second but they were all newer 2 strokes than my Hodaka!

So I want to thank everyone who contributed to helping me with her restoration! But especially to Dan Cooke who has been coaching me via telephone for the last month or so. It was a great surprise to place in the show! ; D Victor

[viclioce]

https://www.facebook.com/viclioce/video ... 78/?type=3

A link to a short video of me riding the Hodaka! Just in case someone wanted to see it! ; D Victor

[RichardMott]

I would have enjoyed the video more if you had been wearing a helmet.

[hodakamax]

But he did have a giant smile on his face!

[viclioce]

Richard. You're right I should have. But it was the first ride and I went less than an 1/8th of a mile. I was also on private property. And NM doesn't have a mandatory helmet law for folks 18+! It's not an excuse just an explanation. And yes, Max, a Great Big Smile!!! ; D Victor

[viclioce]

I made another change today. I upped the main jet from a 140 to a 150. It was bogging down a bit during take off, now it seems to have smoothed out a bit more on take off with the 150 main. Paul's post to me about a 160 main being optimal for 7,000 feet in elevation is looking more & more correct! Anyone have a 160 main jet they are willing to trade for a bigger or smaller main jet? I have a bunch and will consider an even trade if someone has a 160 main they don't need. Or I can trade for carb needles, or other minor carb parts. Let me know what you would like in trade if you don't need or want a different sized main jet! ; D Victor