Clutch disc spacers

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viclioce
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Clutch disc spacers

Post by viclioce »

I have to ask one more time. This Ace B didn’t have a clutch on it when I bought it. Motors (2) were in a box with no clutch, no pinion gear & bushing, no clutch disc, nada. Usually, I would just put the clutch back on with the spacers already there.

So with a newly blue printed clutch, how many & which size spacers should I try to start with? I haven’t put oil in the motor yet, figuring I may need to adjust the spacers. I know I have 1 .002, 2, .003 & 1 .005 spacers. I may have more. But I’m not sure how many to start with. So ANY advise on what to try and how to know how many and which size would be greatly appreciated. I’m in unknown territory here and don’t want to screw up a new clutch! Thanks! :ugeek: Victor

1978 175SL
1976 03 Wombat
1975 99 Road Toad (2)
1973 96 Dirt Squirt (2)
1973 “Wombat Combat”
1973 Combat Wombat
1972 94 Wombat (2)
1972 Super Squirt
1971 92B+ Ace
1970 92B Ace 100B (2)
1968 92 Ace 100
1966 Ace 90
; D Victor
trevtt600
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by trevtt600 »

Victor,

It's really a trial and error thing. Place your gasket on the clutch cover, place a few spacers on the throughout bearing, place the cover on the engine, and check your free play. Should be 3/32". Repeat of needed with more or less spacers. Know one could tell you how many to use, as we don't know the clutch friction plate thickness or wear plates.

I just went through this on my 92.

Trever
taber hodaka
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by taber hodaka »

That's the way we have always done it. Everything from the factory new, was a different story. So many factors normal and excessive wear. Are the clutch disks aftermarket worn, new, sometimes they seem a little thicker. Is it a stock clutch for the correct model and year? victor what is wrong with my piano when I don't hear sound? Just old cranky here --------------Clarence 28 degree's here today
viclioce
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by viclioce »

“What’s wrong with my piano....” not quite in the same catagory. I piano repairman might know & fix it.

I thought I was clear that it was a brand new clutch pac, one from Terry. So that’s fact already provided. I also stated I blue printed the clutch. So your statement is, no one knows because it’s always trial and error? I thought someone who’s done this before could at least make a starting recommendation. But, I guess, based on your statement, I’ll go it alone. Thanks. :( Victor

1978 175SL
1976 03 Wombat
1975 99 Road Toad (2)
1973 96 Dirt Squirt (2)
1973 “Wombat Combat”
1973 Combat Wombat
1972 94 Wombat (2)
1972 Super Squirt
1971 92B+ Ace
1970 92B Ace 100B (2)
1968 92 Ace 100
1966 Ace 90
; D Victor
thrownchain
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Joined: Sun Jul 21, 2013 8:52 am

Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by thrownchain »

Start with the .005 ,you will have to juggle sizes to get the clearance you want. It’s not that difficult
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Bullfrog
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Location: Oregon, 12 miles from the center of the Hodaka Universe(Athena)

Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by Bullfrog »

I'm sorry you couldn't accept the (correct) answer you got the first time you asked about this.

Clarence has given you the correct answer to your question (asked a second time).

Have you accepted the answer this time?

Ed
Keep the rubber side down!
viclioce
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by viclioce »

Well, my understanding was that you need more discs when the clutch is new & as the clutch wears, you remove some of them to allow for the wear in the clutch. Is this a correct statement?

I wasn’t trying to be an Ahole, it just seems like there would be a standard or a starting point. Usually the answers given here are more than just ‘try something and see if it works.’ I guess folks have spoiled me with their explicit & detailed explanations in the past? :ugeek:

1978 175SL
1976 03 Wombat
1975 99 Road Toad (2)
1973 96 Dirt Squirt (2)
1973 “Wombat Combat”
1973 Combat Wombat
1972 94 Wombat (2)
1972 Super Squirt
1971 92B+ Ace
1970 92B Ace 100B (2)
1968 92 Ace 100
1966 Ace 90
; D Victor
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Bullfrog
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Location: Oregon, 12 miles from the center of the Hodaka Universe(Athena)

Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by Bullfrog »

Maybe I need more fiber.

But it is pretty clear that you are not accepting the direct and clear information provided to you that selecting the thickness of the stack of shims after rebuilding the clutch IS a "trial-and-error" procedure. If Clarence or I could give a specific answer . . . we would have.

It would be possible to develop a long, involved procedure to obtain specific measurements identifying how far "out" the clutch face is from the center case "face", and measure the "throw out bearing" . . . and, in the clutch cover - distance from gasket surface to end of pressure piece, . . . annnnnd gasket thickness . . . thhhhennnn do a bunch of cipherin" . . . and end up with a "calculated shim stack thickness" to try. And then you'd find the calculated shim stack thickness was close, but not quite right . . .

. . . and you'd take the clutch cover off to "trial-and-error" adding or removing shims to dial in the clutch lever freeplay (and we'd be back where we started).
Ed
Keep the rubber side down!
taber hodaka
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by taber hodaka »

The point is I am not just trying something, I am goimg through a process, so that I end up with the desired freeplay for my clutch. It is a mechanical process with many variables. I personally start with about three spacers then add or subtract until I get the desired setting. It is not trial and error as we are not racing with a guessed number. Kinda like setting the valves on a engine not a guess but following a process. The piano was meant to be a plus in your direction as you have a talent in a area that I know nothing about. It is time for UP WITH HODAKA. -------------------- Clearance pun
viclioce
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by viclioce »

Well, I REALLY WAS looking for help. That’s why I kept asking.....

Clarence, thanks for the answer of starting with the .005 spacer. That gives me a starting off point. I currently have the .002, .003 & .005 on it all together. I didn’t know if that was way too much, or just barely enough.

Ed. You may not realize it, but you’re response was pretty darned mean. I was asking for my own ignorance and not because I “couldn’t accept Clarence’s (our any one else’s) answer.” I was truly confused and simply looking for a place to start. Clarence came through with that ‘suggestion’ which is all I was looking for. How much for a starting point.

From my perspective it was like if someone asked where should a spark plug be gapped and everyone was answering ‘try somewhere between .000 and .050. You’ll figure it out eventually when the bike runs.’ It wasn’t like I was asking for a carved in stone answer to ‘what premix ratio should I use.’

Remember, I said the clutch issue was something which was brand new to me. The blue printing instructions you wrote were concise & easy to follow. I easily did 2 different clutch cages. But the spacer issue I had NO IDEA WHERE TO START. I didn’t know if 1, .002 was a place to start, or if I needed a .002, a .003 and a .005 all together as a starting point. I wasn’t trying to hold someone to a specific answer and was coming back later to say your were wrong.

If heard rumors in the past of people who left the forum because they were treated rudely or like their question was stupid. Now I can understand why someone would feel that way.

This place is a gold mine of combined talents and information. And if the idea is to gain a bigger membership, responding like you did last evening should be avoided to prevent other people, who might have a lower tolerance than me, to just quit and leave.

Remember, you can’t read a tone of voice. You can’t read a voice inflection. And I’m guessing from this exchange that you can’t read a real sense of confusion, and that causes assuming.

My question may have been an age old question that has been answered in the past, but to me, it was new and difficult to understand the apparent (to me anyway) vagueness as to how it was answered. A simple ‘try starting with just the .005 spacer first and add or delete as needed,’ would have sent me happily on my way.

Thanks, in the future, for your “continued” understanding. :ugeek: Victor

1978 175SL
1976 03 Wombat
1975 99 Road Toad (2)
1973 96 Dirt Squirt (2)
1973 “Wombat Combat”
1973 Combat Wombat
1972 94 Wombat (2)
1972 Super Squirt
1971 92B+ Ace
1970 92B Ace 100B (2)
1968 92 Ace 100
1966 Ace 90
; D Victor
viclioce
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by viclioce »

Clarence, I understood your piano analogy and was just riding along with you. :ugeek: Victor

1978 175SL
1976 03 Wombat
1975 99 Road Toad (2)
1973 96 Dirt Squirt (2)
1973 “Wombat Combat”
1973 Combat Wombat
1972 94 Wombat (2)
1972 Super Squirt
1971 92B+ Ace
1970 92B Ace 100B (2)
1968 92 Ace 100
1966 Ace 90
; D Victor
thrownchain
Posts: 1919
Joined: Sun Jul 21, 2013 8:52 am

Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by thrownchain »

Not a stupid question if you don’t know the answer, as for the difference between spark plug gap and clutch shimming. Plug gap is a static setting. Clutch shimming is not, there are too many variables to give a standard response outside of you have to try different combos of shims . Technically you could start with no shims and then add shims till you have the required clearances. It may take a couple of tries to get it right, but it is doable, biggest pain is taking the cover on and off.
viclioce
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by viclioce »

See, now you’re giving the kind of answer that really helps pointing someone who has ZERO experience a starting point. Thanks Dan!!! That makes it so much clearer and less “scary” to pursue! Turns out ‘Asking a second time” really wasn’t a bad idea after all!!! Stay safe and keep the humor coming.

In closing, I’ll ask you a new question! Why is an icy sidewalk like music? Because if you don’t see sharp (C#) you’ll be flat (Bb)!!!!!!
Last edited by viclioce on Fri Apr 03, 2020 3:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

1978 175SL
1976 03 Wombat
1975 99 Road Toad (2)
1973 96 Dirt Squirt (2)
1973 “Wombat Combat”
1973 Combat Wombat
1972 94 Wombat (2)
1972 Super Squirt
1971 92B+ Ace
1970 92B Ace 100B (2)
1968 92 Ace 100
1966 Ace 90
; D Victor
viclioce
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Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2014 5:35 pm
Location: Santa Fe, NM
Contact:

Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by viclioce »

OK Ed. This one is for you.

As a teacher for 15 years one learns the process of learning. In oversimplified terms it goes like this....

1. I hear, I forget.
2. I see, I remember.
3. I do, I understand.

As a teacher I’ve learned through the years that if one doesn’t hear or see, then one typically doesn’t try or do, and does not reach the point of understanding.

Yelling at students, or treating them like they are being an inconvenience, especially without thinking if your answer is helpful or is it something which will pass on knowledge, simply defeats both the teacher & the learner.

When someone asks a question repeatedly, it usually means they are still in the first stage of the learning process, or they are stuck and the answer isn’t providing resolution. That is all. :ugeek: Victor

1978 175SL
1976 03 Wombat
1975 99 Road Toad (2)
1973 96 Dirt Squirt (2)
1973 “Wombat Combat”
1973 Combat Wombat
1972 94 Wombat (2)
1972 Super Squirt
1971 92B+ Ace
1970 92B Ace 100B (2)
1968 92 Ace 100
1966 Ace 90
; D Victor
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Bullfrog
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Location: Oregon, 12 miles from the center of the Hodaka Universe(Athena)

Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by Bullfrog »

I'm sorry you took my post as mean. I gave it considerable thought before hitting the "submit" button. It was yet another attempt to urge you to see, read, comprehend - the answers you request online. (Hmmmm, see item 2 in your immediate previous post.)

Your work ethic on rebuilding Hodies is epic! Please just refocus a teensy bit of that energy on reading/comprehending/internalizing the factual information you request (and get) from this forum. Please follow your own item #2 for teaching/learning.

Ed
Keep the rubber side down!
thrownchain
Posts: 1919
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by thrownchain »

Quick heads up, Clarence is Taber hodaka, Dan is thrownchain.
viclioce
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by viclioce »

Thank you Dan. I know I get that mixed up sometimes... :ugeek: Victor

1978 175SL
1976 03 Wombat
1975 99 Road Toad (2)
1973 96 Dirt Squirt (2)
1973 “Wombat Combat”
1973 Combat Wombat
1972 94 Wombat (2)
1972 Super Squirt
1971 92B+ Ace
1970 92B Ace 100B (2)
1968 92 Ace 100
1966 Ace 90
; D Victor
taber hodaka
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Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2013 6:34 pm

Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by taber hodaka »

Yea I wish I had a piano! ---------------- Clarence
MTrat
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Location: Montana

Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by MTrat »

After 35 years a science teacher, I just couldn't resist this Will Rogers quote: 'Some people learn by listening, others need to be shown, and some people just have to pee on the electric fence themselves.' No offense intended for anyone.
matt glascock
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by matt glascock »

Here's a poem I submitted in 9th grade English class:

When I was young, without much sense
I took a pi$$ on a 'lectric fence.
Zapped my a$$, shocked my ba11s
The I took a crap in my overalls.

Then I went to the principals office

PS- Ideally, this should be somewhat offensive to virtually everyone :)
Last edited by matt glascock on Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
givergas
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Location: minnesota

Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by givergas »

they should of gave you points for trying rhymes too....
matt glascock
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by matt glascock »

Negative. Just another installment of the same old chorus that began "Matt's behavior..." I practically had my own director's chair in the principal's office.
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ossa95d
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Location: Manchester Vermont

Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by ossa95d »

Thanks for the chuckle Matt! I told a dirty joke for "Show and Tell" in second grade. I won't repeat the joke here but that was the beginning of a long and somewhat permanent residence in the Principal's office for me... Good memories!
Ivan AKA "Pop"
matt glascock
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Re: Clutch disc spacers

Post by matt glascock »

It was tough work Pop. Hey, someone had to do it! I'd bet they all had a good laugh in the teacher's lounge.
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