More Road Toad kick start questions .....

[Alberta Mike]

Thanks for all the replies for my first post below about my concerns with the limited kick start travel on my 100 Road Toad. I did a bit of an experiment yesterday ...... I removed the right side foot peg and rear brake pedal & activation rod, and this allowed me to see how far the kick start lever could move downwards and still turn the engine over. As expected, it continued to turn the engine over well past the spot where the foot peg normally stops it. So I'm thinking, what about re-positioning the kick start lever on the shaft?

So here would be my plan ...... 1)remove the kick start lever & return spring assembly from the shaft 2) rotate the shaft counter counter-clockwise (normal rotation direction) until it stops (makes contact with the inside start mechanism) 3) back the shaft off a tiny amount clockwise 4) reinstall the kick start lever and spring assembly onto the shaft.

So what this would do then is take up what I think is the excessive slack at the top of the downward kick movement, and this would give me more spin on the engine for starting. Rotating the shaft counter-clockwise (see above) might be a bit tricky but I have a plan for doing that.

Any comments on my plan?

I could also use some advice on removing the kick start/spring assembly from the shaft. Some passive force yesterday showed that it was on the shaft pretty tight so I just left it as is for now anyways. And yes, I did remove the large pinch bolt as well as the smaller allen-head retaining bolt on the assembly.

[RichardMott]

A- Mike,

If the set up is about the same as other Hodakas, I think the best advice would be to do as I have done in the past.
Lay the bike on its shifter side.
Rotate the kicker counterCW and hold it with a screwdriver or Tywrap.
Remove the clutch cover, being careful with the gasket. (it can be re-used if not damaged) The oil will not come out while on its side.
Loosen and remove the clamping bolt on the kicker.
Spread the split with a screwdriver an remove the kicker.
With the clutch cover now removed, you can re-index and install the kicker further clockwise giving it more starting travel
Install the kicker and bolt.
Rotate it back again so the clutch cover can be re-installed.
You should now have full kicker travel.

[Alberta Mike]

Hi Rick, thanks for the reply, I think I follow you OK, obviously a wet clutch. I'm not too much of a bike mechanic, I guess most Japanese bikes have a wet clutch, that would be the gearbox oil I suspect.

Here's the one part I don't understand from your post ........ "With the clutch cover now removed, you can re-index and install the kicker further clockwise giving it more starting travel" ....... How does having the clutch cover off enable me to reset the position of the kick starter assembly in a different location (further counter-clockwise) on the shaft?

Hopefully this new question I'm asking makes sense to you.

[RichardMott]

Mike,

I am not sure exactly on Road Toads, but on other small bore Hodakas, the clutch cover is what prevents the kicker fro rotating further CW.
With the cover removed, one can then reload the spring at a longer rotation after re-installing it at a 2 o'clock position.

[RichardMott]

Mike,

I just looked at the 2 RT parts schematic. Item # 67 is the rubber stop that prevents the kicker from rotating CW. My procedure is valid.

See schematic;

https://www.strictlyhodaka.com/Parts-List-A-s/2125.htm

[Alberta Mike]

I'm out the door .... will reply later today. Thanks, MIKE

[Bullfrog]

Rick's procedure is spot on. Removing the clutch cover allows you to install the kick start lever on the splines AND the return spring at the same time without the spring being "wound up" (ie, spring in a relaxed state). Then the kick starter can be "wound back" (rotated in the normal kicking direction) without hitting anything. With the kick starter lever held "back" (out of the way) - the clutch cover can be reinstalled. By following that procedure, the kick start lever will be in the "right" place on the splines AND the kick start return spring will have the proper amount of preload AND it is easy to do.

Ed

[BrianZ]

Repositioning the kickstart on the spline won't give it any more travel. With the kickstart lever and spring removed the shaft can be rotated backwards infinitely, sort of like winding a watch. The end result is that the kickstart lever can be positioned anywhere on the shaft and the engagement point will always be the same.

Brian

[RichardMott]

From what I am gathering here, he is starting out too far CCW to get a good amount of kick travel engagement. Someone might have installed the kicker with the clutch cover on, making it out of position.
Re-positioning further to the right will give him the increased travel.

Does that make sense?

[olddogs]

Don't forget to listen for the "clink" when the clutch dowel falls out of the clutch cover as soon as the cover is lifted. This needs to be located and returned to is place in the clutch arm mechanism inside the cover. I guarantee this little bugger will drop out. Stick it in back place with a good dab of grease. Neglecting to find this and put it back in will result in a "no clutch" condition and cause you to start the job over.

[RichardMott]

Yes, I should have warned about the clutch pin that needs a bit of grease to hold it in place while re-installing the cover.
Easy to lose in the fray of assembly/disassembly. Big problem if it is lost inside.

[Alberta Mike]

Rick ...... I'm beginning to figure this out at least a little bit. So now in reference to this quote of yours ...

"From what I am gathering here, he is starting out too far CCW to get a good amount of kick travel engagement. Someone might have installed the kicker with the clutch cover on, making it out of position. Re-positioning further to the right will give him the increased travel."

Yes, it appears that first sentence of yours is my situation. Just as an experiment, I removed the rubber bumper from the clutch cover (which is still on). The return spring then rotates the shaft back further clockwise (and the kick lever more "up") . And it grabs the start mechanism (inside) in this new location which gives me a full and probably complete starting stroke (ie. with the bumper out and a smaller appx. 3/8" gap between the lever and the clutch cover). This isn't fixing anything I don't think, I'm just saying that there is a point further clockwise where it grabs. A shorter bumper would enable this modified setup and provide some cushioning but not as much as the stock bumper. Might not be a good idea though.

And I think I get the post by Bullfrog referring to taking the clutch cover off which allows a person to install everything with the spring "unwound" (or relaxed) as opposed to trying to do it with the clutch cover on (and the spring wound up somewhat). Doing it that way might not be fun.

I'll keep picking away at this and will report in later. Thanks to all for their help so far.

[viclioce]

Also remember SoCal's trick of placing a magnet on the clutch lever to hold the dowel in place! That way it doesn't drop out! I went nuts with that piece until he posted that trick. Now it never falls out on me! Victor