Soldering to the condenser - a better way?

[spudman]

Hey guys...after reading through one horror story after another of members trying to get that clump of 4 wires soldered to the top of the condenser, I'm wondering if anyone has come up with a better way to do it that won't require me to order a handful of condensers to replace all the ones I screw up. Is there any type of a "heat sink" setup that anyone has used to direct or pull heat away from the condenser when you're soldering to it? What about soldering a single wire to the top of the condenser and then soldering that wire to the other "clump"? There just isn't much slack in any of those wires (in my case...on a model 99 Road Toad) and I'm trying to find the best way around this imminent disaster.
Thanks!

[Bullfrog]

The "single wire into four wires" is a pretty good plan.

Another good technique - but one which may difficult to put into practice - is to use an old fashioned "soldering iron". These "irons" had a screwdriver handle and shaft with a large pointed end. The large end was heated with a torch (or in a bed of coals) to soldering temperature (touch the iron with solder to test). Then the large heated end is applied to the condenser "joint". The massive amount of heat in the old fashioned soldering iron brings the joint up to soldering temp very quickly, allowing the solder to flow quickly AND allowing getting the heat off the condenser rapidly (which eliminates the long, sloooow heating we see with a standard 40W or even 100W modern soldering tool). Application of a damp (thoroughly wrung out) cloth to promote immediate cooling also helps protect the condenser.
Ed

[spudman]

I'll have to ask around to see if anyone I know has one of the old soldering irons, Ed. It sure sounds like a better & quicker way to go. I seem to remember also seeing a thread somewhere regarding the relocation of the condenser...up under the tank maybe? It looks like at least some of the wires in the "clump" originate up there anyway, and it wouldn't be all that hard to extend the others up to that location. Anyone remember who it was that tried (or better yet, perfected) this option?

[taber hodaka]

How many do you want and what size?? I remember Ed saying some time back to use a large one. ----------- Clarence

I will post pictures.

[dcooke007]

I'll have to ask around to see if anyone I know has one of the old soldering irons, Ed. It sure sounds like a better & quicker way to go. I seem to remember also seeing a thread somewhere regarding the relocation of the condenser...up under the tank maybe? It looks like at least some of the wires in the "clump" originate up there anyway, and it wouldn't be all that hard to extend the others up to that location. Anyone remember who it was that tried (or better yet, perfected) this option?

Here you go, viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2186. Condenser is Daiichi 617-027. Honda part # 30250-329-305.

Danny Cooke

[spudman]

Boy...that looks really nice Danny! I'm going to go out and check to see if my wiring is the same as what you have on your 03 Wombat. I'm thinking it is, as when I compare the electrical component specs of the two bikes...everything is identical. I am curious though...how is it that by simply teeing this new condenser into the black wire up by the coil...it does the same thing as the stock condenser? I mean, in essence...are all the other wires in that original "clump" that was soldered onto the condenser still making electrical "contact" with the condenser somehow with this setup like they were originally? Also, did you research or somehow test/measure this particular condenser to compare it to the OEM Hodaka unit? To be honest...I don't even know how condensers are measured!

[dcooke007]

Spudman,
Hodaka condenser capacitance spec is .25 to .27 mf plus or minus 10 %.....at least for the 125's. In researching this issue I found there are a lot of point ignition similarities between other brands of this time period. Every condenser I could find specs for were .25 mf for single cylinder engines of this time period. So the search was on for a proper spec condenser that would tee into the Hodaka wiring harness. The condenser selected is for a 1975 Honda MT250K1 and other Honda models. It is rated at .25 mf and falls within the Hodaka spec.

"I am curious though...how is it that by simply teeing this new condenser into the black wire up by the coil...it does the same thing as the stock condenser?"
It is kind of like Nike..."just do it". Sorry could not help myself. The black wire from the condenser goes to the coil...so by teeing into the black wire at the coil connection the condenser is still part of the circuit... but just at a different location. Many other brands locate their condensers remote from the engine. In this case it eliminates having to solder the condenser which seems to be a problem for some.

Danny Cooke

[spudman]

Nike it is! (Even though I'm a New Balance guy.) LOL
OK...now it makes sense to me. As long as the condenser is anywhere in the circuit, it will do its job. Of course now I just need to research exactly what it is that a condenser does.
The 617-027 part is plentiful on eBay. Many are not listed as Daiichi, but rather "Sudco" or no brand name at all. I'm going to order one tonight, as that certainly looks like a great way to avoid the microsurgery with a soldering iron that I'd have to attempt if I left the condenser where it is.
Thanks again for your help Danny.

[rileybill]

Hi Danny Cooke! I have been watching this thread with great interest as I'm having an issue with my 100B+. Its been running poorly from about 1/8 throttle up. 'four stroking' I think .... I thought it was a tuning issue, but all adjustments have had no impact. I pulled the stator plate and there appears to be a small 'burn' on the points contact surface. I therefore thought maybe its an issue with the points and/or condenser. My soldering skills are low, and was very worried about trying to replace my current points and condenser as it sounds like this is a little art and science ... which I have neither. Will this modification and the parts you reference work on my 100B+?

[dcooke007]

Hi Danny Cooke! I have been watching this thread with great interest as I'm having an issue with my 100B+. Its been running poorly from about 1/8 throttle up. 'four stroking' I think .... I thought it was a tuning issue, but all adjustments have had no impact. I pulled the stator plate and there appears to be a small 'burn' on the points contact surface. I therefore thought maybe its an issue with the points and/or condenser. My soldering skills are low, and was very worried about trying to replace my current points and condenser as it sounds like this is a little art and science ... which I have neither. Will this modification and the parts you reference work on my 100B+?

Hey Bill,
This modification would work on your 100b+. Before you do that might be a good idea to try cleaning and adjusting points first. Try pulling a piece of 600 grit sand paper through the points to polish the contacts and remove any raised material. Clean point contacts with electrical contact cleaner, laquer thinner or acetone. The idea is to have no reside remaining on the point contacts. Adjust points to .012 inch. Don't forget a new spark plug. You can call me if needed.

Danny Cooke