Gear oil

[taz]

I belive my manual is saying 30 w but I have noticed on here there is people saying 80 w , I'm confused once again ??? Stock motor 125 Wmbat 1972 ... thanks

[Zyx]

30W non-detergent motor oil, which is just about impossible to find anyway, has the same relative viscosity as 80W gear oil. The numeric value for viscosity is not constant between applications of oil. So anything in a 75 or 80W gear lube is going to work fine.

[Bullfrog]

. . . and I would add that 70 or 80 wt gear oil designated for use in wet clutch motorcycle engines would be an improvement over the 1960's era factory recommendation for 30 wt non-detergent motor oil. (and confirm that the viscosity scales used for motor oil and gear oil are different)

Ed

[viclioce]

For those who have difficulty finding non-detergent 30w oil, I have a recommendation. We have done a lot of research on the Delphi LC1500/C90 forum and many many of us use Shell Rotella. The Rotella oils are diesel oils with low detergents & no added friction modifiers. The Rotella T1 is a mono grade oil rated for diesel motors. The T1 is a multi grade oil, a 10w40 and the T6 is a 5w40 full synthetic. There are no friction modifiers in these diesel oils. The only one to avoid is the T5 which does have traditional friction modifiers.

I'm currently running the Rotella T in my Hodaka. I also have been running the T6 in my Suzuki VL1500 for about 8 years now. The oil performs well, meets or exceeds all the JASO MA standards for my big bore VTwin and the Rotella T has been running very well in my Hodaka so far.

Just passing this info on for anyone who wants an alternative oil for consideration! ; D Victor

[Zyx]

From Shell Oil website regarding Rotella:

"PROTECTION AGAINST DEPOSITS

The performance benefits of the unique combination of dispersants and detergents, boosted by the use of the dualfunction additive component, are seen in enhanced engine cleanliness and viscosity control compared to previous generation oils (API CI-4 PLUS). Deposit and sludge control: Our formula contains more dispersant molecules to control sludge and more antioxidant molecules to control deposits, as demonstrated in the laboratory and in the field. Piston cleanliness: Our Triple Protection® technology features a unique, exclusive detergent system, specifically designed to control piston deposits in the hotter environments of latemodel engines, as well as provide exceptional piston cleanliness in older engines."

Diesel engines in particular require high detergent oil because they are adept at putting particulates into the oil. Ever wonder why diesel oil gets dirty so fast? Detergent.

[racerclam]

Just throwing this in , Red Line diesel oil contains 3xs the amount that they use in the oil they make for gasoline engines . And that is tha only difference between the two. In my Fleet of Hodakas I have used thier 10-40 gasoline oil as well as thier 75-90 GL5 gear oil also thier MTL manual transmission oil , Thier Racing ATF and Currently im using thier Shock proof gear oil. All oils I have used work great . Point is the gear box and clutch on Your Hodaka isnt too picky on what you put in it especially if your using the good clutch friction discs and not the old fiber one that atr prone to glazing .

Rich

[Zyx]

Why Hodaka specified non-detergent oil back in the 60's and 70's may have more to do with what was in detergent oil at the time than a specific need for an oil that had none. Or, it might have had to do with a tendency for detergent oils of the day to infiltrate and expand the clutch disc material used then. Not sure. But I don't think that detergent by itself causes issues with modern production discs and I can't believe it is an issue with the metal parts in the gear case. Friction modifiers might cause issues I suppose, depending on what they are. Some gear oil is specified as compatible with wet clutch operation, some not. The differences may be real or may be esoteric. Generally I just follow what is on the label as a guide when choosing gear oil. I don't use motor oil in the gear box mainly because there are so many excellent products available otherwise that are designed for the purpose. Whether diesel oils generally have frictions modifiers, whatever those may be, is a mystery to me, unless zinc falls into that category. I used DELO for many years in my '79 Mustang Cobra with a 5.0 V8. It worked very nicely even though intended for diesel engines, and is still an excellent oil for most applications not specifying some kind of zero weight oil. I have no problems with diesel oils used in non-diesel applications, although there is still a raging debate on the Internet over the question.

My understanding is that diesel oils have either zinc or some similar anti-abrasion, anti-shock additive, and most detergent oils back in the 70's probably did have as well, for the same reason: most engines then were flat tappet devices that needed cam lobe protection. These days only specialty oils have zinc, and most engine other than diesels have roller cams or roller tipped cam followers. Whether zinc caused an issue with old clutch discs is an open question, but since modern gas engine lubricants no longer use zinc, perhaps the old prohibition against detergent oil is obsolete as a result.

I have used ATF in the gear box and far as I know it works well. I don't use it anymore because, as I mentioned, there are a lot of excellent products now available made for that job, including gear oil with about the same viscosity as ATF.

Bottom line for me is that you can use Rotella if you wish, with or without detergents, but I would not assume that Rotella has no detergent. Shell thinks it does. I think it no longer matters. I suspect that gear case lubes have detergents as well.

[viclioce]

Well AZ, I never said it was non-detergent, just that it had no friction modifiers in it which would effect wet clutches. I agree with you that today's detergents are fairly esoteric compared to those of the 60's & 70's. However, I have used the T6 in my VL1500 fo over 8 years and have over 71K miles on on the clutch. No wear to speak of, maybe .002 to .003 so far. The T6 is a full synthetic and the T is regular Dino oil. So with all the difficulties in finding 30w non-detergent oils, I'm happy with finding oils that won't coat my clutch plates with Teflon! It works for me and until or unless I find something better, I'll continue to use it! ; D Victor